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Interview with Aaron Sleazy

Microphone

Une version française de cette interview est disponible.

Everything started during this summer, I found the Aaron Sleazy interview on cliffslist.com. Then, a few weeks after publishing an article about him and his unique style, Aaron wrote back to me to announce that his new book was on Amazon’s shelves. We exchanged a few e-mails back and forth and ended up with this interview. I found very valuable content in it myself and hope you will too !

Allan

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Hello Aaron ! It’s great to have you answer our questions ! According to the interview you made with Clifford from Cliffslist.com earlier this year, you are 29 and were born in Germany. Now you live in Berlin, but you spent 2 years in London. You started picking up women regularly during those 2 years. Before that, you were still a virgin and had only made out with ten women or so. Is that right ? What would you want to add to present yourself better, Aaron ?

Most of this is right. I turned 30 recently. I began to study seduction in earnest in 2008 — up to that point I had been with exactly one girl — and less than one year later I got to a point where I could have sex with women literally within minutes. However, these few sentences might give a rather misleading impression. Although my sexual history was virtually nonexistent — I kissed a girl at 16 the first time, and the second time at 25 –, it is not true that I was one of those seemingly completely hopeless cases. In fact, I thought there were more important things in life than pursuing women, so I spent most of my energies on my education, and on sports.

In 2006 I discovered mASF but didn’t take much of it seriously — and I still don’t. You know, magic tricks, NLP, patterns, routines, “structured game” and all that stuff. Besides, partly because of my academic background, I am arrogant enough to immediately dismiss materials that are contradictory or implausible.

For instance, in Mystery Method the concept of “value” is stressed. Techniques are being introduced that have the aim of making you appear as a guy that can provide (!) for a girl, which is the exact opposite of what a seducer wants. I did know a couple of guys that got plenty of girls (and girlfriends) from hookups in clubs. According to Mystery, however, this is not “solid game” but a “fool’s mate” and doesn’t count. But if you are willing to accept the results of actual scientific research, there is a clear consensus that mate selection is the domain of the woman. If she doesn’t want you, you can perform as many magic tricks as you want and it won’t change a thing. Thus, the whole premise of the seduction mainstream seems wrong to me. Seduction is a mutual process, and not “Geeks Gone Wild” who run around the club, spouting out their “openers” and hoping that the girls will not immediately reject them.

Many of those self-proclaimed “gurus” claim that “looks don’t matter”, but if you go to any public gathering, you’ll quickly notice that the exact opposite is true. LoveSystems teach that you should “display wealth”, but that doesn’t stop some of my boho friends from banging three girls a week.

Sorry to interrupt. What does “boho” mean ?

“Boho” is short for “bohemian”… Anyway, let me just finish my rant: My impression of the “seduction industry” only got worse when I did some more research and found out that large parts of it appear to be almost fraudulent. Some of those alleged “big names” became instructors or started their own company after having slept with a total of one (!) girl. I think it was Sinn who called out Mehow on his “guru” status. There is a post on Sinn’s blog where he digs up a quote from Mehow on the Mystery Method forum, where Mehow admitted that he had gotten only one girl so far. Some weeks later, he was just another of those alleged gurus. There are other cases, and probably too many to mention. There is this thread on mASF, actually the most viewed one on that forum, where I talk about this in more detail.

When you say « discovered », do you mean you were actively searching an answer through a search engine ?

Oh, sure. Because plenty of my friends assumed I was a stud, I felt too proud to ask them for help, and I doubt they could have helped me anyway. If nobody seems to have an answer for you, then you turn to Google and type in “how to seduce women.” But what I found was only intriguing as long as I hadn’t actually read it. In fact, had I spent much time reading any of the available materials, I would arguably never have reached the level I have finally reached, which, among others, includes plenty of instances where I had sex with women within minutes, a couple of non-verbal pulls, solely based on physical escalation and one or two “instant-pulls”, where I basically did nothing but walk up to the girl and drag her into the club toilet pretty much immediately. On a side note, some trolls on mASF tried to attack me for my style because it was “not according to the rules”, which only shows how limited some people are.

When I decided to take studying seduction in earnest in early 2008, I took only the advice from a very small number of people, including Nashvilleplayboy on mASF, and I also read a couple of archives, including Razorjack and MrSex4uNYC, which I found tremendously useful. As I said, most of the ideas in the mainstream seduction community seemed just plain wrong to me and didn’t match my experience at all. Thus I became an autodidact for the most part. Luckily, I didn’t know about all those things that were considered impossible.

You mention an important point here which is that your belief system can either limit yourself or release yourself. Henry Ford summed up this marvellously when he said, « Whether you believe you can, or you can’t, you are right ». Part of the hard work is to dismantle those beliefs that prevent you from reaching the best in life.

That’s a great quote, thanks for bringing it to my attention! Obviously, there are some things that are physically impossible, but more often than not also in this domain we as humans only place limitations upon ourselves. Just think of the famous “four minute mile”, which was once thought to be impossible to achieve, and is now standard for middle distance runners!

This one is from a reader: Have you ever been in a situation where you would like to seduce a friend ? Now, with your experience, what would you say to guys who want to do so ?

It’s a common mistake for guys to befriend girls first, with the hope of seducing them later. This doesn’t really work, unless the girl has a similar thought. Some girls believe that friendship is the basis for a great relationship, so she thinks she has to get to know the guy first in order to permit herself to have sex with him. Those girls are pretty messed up, and if you want, I can elaborate on this point later. At best, your reader can expect such a case, i.e. a girl that wants a relationship. The main question is: Does the girl indicate sexual interest? If so, just invite her over to dinner or “watch a movie”, and the rest should follow. However, should you just want to have sex with her, prepare for some drama down the road.

Well, I’d really like you to elaborate on this one because I had three readers asking for this specific problem just during this week ! I’m not an expert at all but here is my point of view. I think part of this happens when you give yourself no choice. Your close social circle is your only way to interact with girls. The more you talk with them as friends, the more connected you feel. And the self-fulfilling prophecy is that you fall in love with her. What’s your point about that ?

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“Falling in love” is an interesting concept. It seems that you are much more likely to feel this emotion if you have little experience with the other sex. You said it’s because those people don’t give themselves any choices, and that’s arguably the core of the problem. They are not used to having choices and obsess over random girls that only have given them some attention. On the other hand, if you are used to having sex with plenty of women, and have a couple of casual relationships on the side, just repeatedly talking to one particular girl will not really affect you. You can still like her, of course, but you won’t end up fantasizing about things that are not there.

One of the benefits of being used to the company of women is that once you feel something for a girl, you know it’s not just because of her looks or because she’s great in bed. Heck, some guys get infatuations just because a girl spends some time with them in a social setting! After my last girlfriend broke up with me this April, because she couldn’t handle the fact that I was seeing other women, I obviously went out looking for a new girl to spend more time with. I went through up to seven or eight girls a month — basically, I got a new girl every single time I went out –, and had a handful of casual relationships, but didn’t feel much of an emotional attachment to them. A special girl had to come along, and fortunately she eventually came along.

It is my theory that as a guy capable of seducing many girls you only go through so many girls because they all leave you unfulfilled in some regard. You constantly look for something deeper, which sadly not many girls can provide. But once you’ve found a special girl, you know that she is worth staying with. Even “players” fall in love.

In reality, though, most men seem to settle for pretty much any girl that would accept them and have relatively unfulfilling relationships. Sometimes, those guys seem to grow very resentful of women, and if they turn into “players” they are more likely to develop into the kind of guy that needs the validation of getting many girls, while being completely unable to emotionally connect with any of them. Probably they were better off before.

From what I’ve read, you are very successful when it comes to picking up women in clubs. You seem to communicate a lot physically. I mean, grabbing them, touching them, hugging, lifting them up … Do you have any mindset behind that ?

I just take what I want. I mean, if you see a hot girl walking past, don’t you just want to take her wrist, pull her in and make out with her? However, it is not the case that I do it randomly. I have a great eye for the receptivity of the girl, and if it’s a girl that looks appealing to me, I just go for it.

You seem to read girls like books and notice the ones opened to an approach. How do you choose the girls you want to go for ? Do you have any favorite criterias, cases where you know it’ll be easy or dead or fun ?

It’s all based on sexual interest, and I only approach girls that give me a sound reason to. If she turns me on and I feel like it, I make a move on her. If not, then not. (This doesn’t stop me from talking to girls if I’m just in a talkative mood.) I know that plenty other guys, like apparently every major company out there, including the big ones Lovesystems and Real Social Dynamics over to smaller players like BradP, seem to be completely oblivious to that and like to tell you that you should approach girls no matter what, and even go as far as to tell you to “build confidence” by approaching a lot of women and getting shot down by many. There is even the advice to “make approaching a habit”. In fact, approaching girls should be a desire for you to follow, not something you habitually do. I can’t quite see what the point of the mainstream advice should be. It’s like with “warm-up sets”, women you are supposed to approach to practice your rehearsed lines and techniques, but whom you have no interest in. What’s that good for?

Well, I can relate to both your point and theirs. My interpretation of this is that some people like myself two years ago are incredible at finding excuses. Even if the girl was a perfect match at first sight, I would make an almost random excuse. I was, like, “She’s hot”, the first second but, “She’s got a slutty style.”, the second one. Thus I didn’t approach her and just let her go. And then I would mentally beat myself for being so stupid. I relate to what they say not so much as to build confidence, but to turn off my logical brain and take action instead of being in spectator mode all my life.

Of course, there is something to be said for changing your habits first. Still, I think this can be easier done with some mental work and not by forcing yourself to approach girl after girl.

How do you catch their attention from the get go ?

Just by making a bold move like walking up to them directly, you’ll get all the attention you need. This is especially true if you only approach women you genuinely want to get to know and who seem to be interested in being approached.

What would you say to men who cares about what others think about them ?

There is just one message: forget about your ego. Nobody cares about you!

There is an interesting piece I read in Cliff’s interview. At one point, you had one week left in Berlin where you were free to do whatever you wanted to do. I think it was before you left for London. You realised that there could be no repercussions at all on your life. The same night you went out and ended up fingering a girl on the dance floor. And a few months later, you realized something… Tell us more about that!

This ties in with your previous question: nobody cares about you. People don’t go to clubs to observe what you are doing. They are either stuck in their own head or out to have fun. That’s the big realisation! You are almost invisible, but of course this only applies if you don’t believe you have to entertain groups and “demonstrate value.” The encounter you mention was taken from the introduction of an earlier draft of my book. Initially, I felt just like doing it, and what allowed me to cross this imaginary boundary was that I’d be in London soon anyway. Months later it struck me that, at least in bigger cities, there are no repercussions at all because in a city of eight million it’s rather unlikely that you’ll bump into the same people again on accident, and the few times you do, they’ll probably just run up to you and hug you excitedly, no matter how brief or insignificant the previous encounter was.

I’ve read The power of the Now from Eckhart Tolle, and what you said in Clifford’s interview about the internal dialog resonates a lot with me. You mentioned that you used to meditate a lot and it allows you to clear your mind and shutdown what I call the « little voice in my head ».  Do you have any exercise or tips to help people clear their mind ? This is a very hard exercise because we are so used to think all the time without being conscious of it.

I do think that this is hard to achieve, but it can be done with discipline. Just spend five to ten minutes a day on Zen mediation. Forget about incenses, ambient music or guided meditations. Just sit down and focus on your breathing. The principles can be picked up quickly. The hard part, though, is practicing it. All the instruction I had was due to one video documentation I watched, a tape I borrowed from my local library, and later I read Zen in the Art of Archery by Eugen Herrigel. If you are interested to try it yourself, it’s simple: Five minutes. No music. No distractions. Start today!

How do you handle competition ?

What competition? For the most part, I don’t even register other men when I’m out. Further, in the roughly two years I have been doing pick-up, I have only had one clear instance of direct competition, where a guy tried to actively interfere and get the intention of the girl I was interacting with. Since I had made out with that girl earlier, all I had to do was making out with her again. It didn’t take long for him to feel stupid, and he left. However, he tried what sounded a lot like community lines.

I know you’ve just released your new book « Sleazy Stories » on Amazon where you talk about your most hilarious and bizarre adventures with women. I’ve just ordered it because I’m curious, even though I prefer meeting women during the day. What is the book about in general ?

Sleazy Stories is a selection of my adventures in 2008, beginning in spring when I started to devote a substantial amount of time and effort to mastering the skill of seducing women. Because I quickly got bored of the usual “pulling a girl home” thing, I began to experiment a lot and followed my fantasies, some of which may get you into legal trouble if you get caught. There are plenty of instances of “public indecencies” in the book, but the point is obviously not to motivate you to do something similar. To summarize it in one sentence, Sleazy Stories is about a man that explores his sexual fantasies and eventually finds ways to fulfill them in real life. I won’t spoil anything, but the reason the book ends with a particular chapter was that I view this encounter as the culmination of my career as a seducer and everything I had dreamed about. Afterwards, I lost my motivation for a while and focused more on a relationship. Eventually, I found other goals to pursue in pick-up, but that’s something for another book.

Why did you decide to write this book ?

I told some of those stories to friends, who found them greatly entertaining. I found my encounters greatly satisfying, and after reading what other people in the seduction community do, it struck me that my style is really unique. I mean, read a “lay report” based on Mystery Method, and you literally fall asleep: read one and you have read them all, because they follow a very rigid structure. They are boring and predictable, which is no surprise if the guys think they have to tell the same “routines” all the time. Even if it works, it’s still boring. Further, it’s painful to read about those guys wasting hours when it’s obvious that the girl wanted to fuck way before.

Who should read your book ?

Judging from the feedback so far, it seems that Sleazy Stories is enjoyable for anyone who has at least a slight interest in sexual matters. The women who have read it said it was an exciting piece of erotic literature — after all, many of my successes are due to the fact that I heavily play into female fantasies –, and men see it as a very entertaining piece of work, not unlike Tucker Max’s book “I hope they serve beer in hell”. Readers who draw this parallel, however, always tell me that my stories are even more outlandish. Those are the people who often also tell me that they’ve finished the book in one or two sittings. Lastly, people studying “game” find it inspirational and eye-opening, saying that it “destroyed limiting beliefs” or points out the inefficiencies in the mainstream of the seduction community.

…and who shouldn’t read your book?

My mother.

Ok, back to your club game! There is an interesting point you talked about in Cliff’s interview: « Most girls, though, are open to being approached by many guys. » Can you talk more about this ? Because I think you hit a point many men are missing !

To me this seems like a rather basic insight. Women are usually very passive and wait for men to approach them, and if you aren’t a complete dork, she’ll give you a chance. After all, girls love to have sex, and they also want to have relationships, so it’s not as if we as men are offering damaged goods when we are hitting on them. (Sure, there are frigid women out there, and it’s probably in your best interest to stay away from them.)

Do you have plans for the future regarding your skills ?

I have achieved everything ever dreamt of achieving — and more! In fact, in 2009 I managed feats such as completely non-verbal seductions, one or two “instant-pulls”, and really crazy things like getting a girl to blow me in an alley (after two or three minutes) while her boyfriend was back in the club, having no idea what was going on. However, at one point I found myself in one of my favorite clubs in Berlin and suddenly it struck me that it would probably be more enjoyable to just call any of my girls to come over.

I have fulfilled all my fantasies and experienced things barely any man has, or barely any man that has to rely on his skills and not on his status or money to get girls. I even had girls thank me that I allowed them to suck me off. That’s the stuff only rock stars experience! At one point, though, I felt I had really done it all. Repetition is boring to me, and because I would not know how I could top what I have done — How do you improve upon a completely nonverbal seduction or an “instant pull” where the girl follows you into the bathroom after two or three seconds? –, I lost my motivation to stay in the game. These days I am in a monogamous relationship with a truly amazing woman. It’s a very gratifying experience and I don’t miss game at all. After all, I think that for most men pick-up is just a phase they are going through, going through woman after woman until they find a special one.

Are you working on something right now ?

I am working on a number of projects right now, but I can’t go into any specifics yet. Let’s just say that I’ve got many more stories that deserve to be written down, and I have started already.

Aaron, thanks a lot for your time ! :)

I thank you for this interview, Allan !

You might want to visit Aaron Sleazy’s website and …
Depending on your location, you might prefer to get Sleazy Stories from :
Amazon France
Amazon Canada
Amazon UK
Amazon USA

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